[Vnbiz] Intel Vietnam refuses to pay bribes

Wed Aug 15 17:49:52 PDT 2007

Dear Ho`a,

Thanks for the quotes.  Partly because i'm an unrepentant if guilt-ridden
Anglophone i'd never heard Georges Bernanos.  Edmund Burke, i'd suspect, is
rather widely known.  In case anyone might be curious of Bernanos'
background, here's a link: http://www.kirjasto.sci.fi/bernanos.htm

On 8/16/07, henry_duong <hduong at sagientresearch.com> wrote:
>
> [ Vietnam Business Forum ]
>
>
> Dear Brother Hoanh,
>
> For what it's worth, I do think you are (to quote you) too
> idealistic when it comes to corruption.  And what is wrong with it,
> you might ask??  ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!
>
> We need more people like you Brother Hoanh.  Bravo!!
>
> A couple of notable quotes on corruption you might enjoy,
>
> The first sign of corruption in a society that is still alive is
> that the end justifies the means. - Georges Bernanos
>
> Among a people generally corrupt liberty cannot long exist. - Edmund
> Burke
>
> Thanks for letting me share and have a great day.
>
> -Ho`a
>
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> > "Tran Dinh Hoanh" <tdhoanh at ...>
> > Sent by: vnbiz-bounces at ...
> > 08/15/2007 01:57 AM
> > Please respond to
> > vnbiz at ...
> >
> >
> > To
> > vnbiz at ...
> > cc
> >
> > Subject
> > Re: [Vnbiz] Intel Vietnam refuses to pay bribes
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [ Vietnam Business Forum ]
> >
> > Dear Sister Bich Lien & CACC,
> >
> > You pose a wonderful question, sister.  Lucky for the students who
> have
> > you as their teacher, Bich :Lien they will learn well!
> >
> > "There must be something else, a part from legislation and
> individual
> > citizens, that make the system the way it did.  An open-ended
> question, to
> > which I have no answer."  That is so true!  Bich Lien, I had that
> question
> > when I was 17, and it followed me for several decades, and during
> that
> > times, I searched for the answer in every thing under the sun; you
> name
> > it, I have searched in it.
> >
> > I have such a strong urge to share with you my long journey, but
> to save
> > everyone's time, let me just share the final observation: The
> missing
> > thing that sis. Bich Lien is looking for is "the standard of
> conduct that
> > the majority of the people demand. "
> >
> > If the majority of people demand the standard that their leaders
> have to
> > be honest, that bribery is bad, then the country will have honest
> leaders
> > and will have less corruption.  If the majority of people think
> that their
> > leaders just have to be "effective" (whatever effective means)but
> don't
> > have to be honest, and that corruption/bribery is an OK way to
> live and to
> > do business, then the country will be marred with lying/cheating
> leaders
> > and corruption will fill the scene.
> >
> > Please note, I say "majority of people." Sister Bich Lien said
> there are
> > MANY good officials.  But many is not enough if that many is still
> the
> > minority.
> >
> > And I say "standard of conduct," meaning, the character traits
> that people
> > look up to and whoever achieves such characters will be admired by
> most
> > people, the character traits that people want their leaders to
> possess .
> > Standard is usually a bit idealistic, because standard is for "the
> best
> > scenario."  Say, the standard score for good student is the
> perfect 10/10.
> >  But few students ever achieve this.  Most good students would get
> 9/10 or
> > 8/10 only.  However, everything being equal, the school that has
> the 10/10
> > standard will produce much better students than the school that
> sets 8/10
> > as its standard.
> >
> > Most people in Vietnam think that paying and receiving bribes is
> OK, it is
> > just a way to do things.  The majority of the people will not
> stand up and
> > say that it is bad and that it must be stopped.  (Since 18 years
> old in
> > college in Saigon, I have fought against most of my friends who
> would
> > convinced me that corruption and bribery is the way to live and
> that I am
> > just naive.  Imagine you hear this from 18 years old kids (who
> were my
> > friends)!  Sad but true.  And today many people still tell me that
> I am
> > too idealistic, that they don't need honest leaders, that they
> believe
> > corruption is an OK or acceptable way to do business, or
> corruption is
> > just a matter of semantic.
> >
> > We will always disagree in many specific circumstances whether a
> sentence
> > spoken is honest or not, or a specific gift or payment is indeed a
> bribe.
> > Application of a rule to a specific case may raise disagreement
> among
> > friends.  That is OK.  But at least, the majority of the people
> have to
> > believe in the rule of honesty and the rule of clean business and
> clean
> > government.  If we don't have the majority, the minority of good
> people
> > won't be enough.
> >
> > How to get that majority?  Simple, keep talking, keep preaching,
> keep
> > teaching, and keep practicing honesty and cleanliness.  It is
> hard,
> > because we all are human, and we all, including me, and especially
> me,
> > fail often for our weaknesses, and we need to eat and pay bills
> and feed
> > our children too.  I know.  But if we have faith in the ultimate
> victory
> > of goodness, will stand up after each fall, and continue talking
> about
> > honesty and clean governance again and again and again, time after
> time
> > after time, regardless of what the negative people may say, then
> > eventually that majority will be achieved.
> >
> > Trust me.  Have faith!
> >
> > Have a great day, sis. Bich Lien and all.
> >
> > Hoanh
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/15/07, Bui Bich Lien <lien.bb at ...> wrote:
> > [ Vietnam Business Forum ]
> >
> >
> >
> > Anh Hoanh and CACC,
> >
> > 1.      The OECD member countries adopted a Convention on
> Combating
> > Bribery of Foreign Public Officials in International Business
> Transactions
> > in 1997.
> >
> > 2.      Corruption in Vietnam, as elsewhere, is often systematic.
> So I
> > guess that an institutional approach to corruption may help
> enlighten the
> > problem.  Having said this, I do not mean to underestimate the
> fact that
> > ethical individuals/citizens are jewels in every society.  But as
> Nam Cao
> > stated [almost hundred years ago] in the famous Chi Pheo "tao muon
> lam
> > nguoi tu te, nhung ai cho tao lam nguoi tu te" (I want to be a
> good
> > person, but who allows me to do that???).  Within my limited
> circle of
> > friends/acquaintances, I already know MANY public officials in
> Vietnam who
> > have relatively high ethical standards and want to be good
> citizens.  But
> > it's the fact that they are operating in a system that is known
> for high
> > level of corruption.  The system has not been mature enough to
> facilitate
> > them to do what they want -- life is a matter of choice, and I can
> well
> > understand one's choice of survival before ethical.  If the US has
> FCPA,
> > Vietnam has an Anti-corruption Law too.  And I just mentioned,
> Vietnam
> > seems not lack ethical officials/professionals either.  There must
> be
> > something else, apart from legislation, and individual citizens,
> that
> > makes the system the way it is.  An open-ended question, to which
> I have
> > no answer.
> >
> > Rgs,
> >
> > Lien
> >
> >
> > --
> > Tran Dinh Hoanh, Esq., LLB, JD
> > Washington DC _______________________________________________
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