[Vnbiz] Ngoai Hinh Can Doi (Proportionate Body)

[Craig Stevenson]

Hi All:

Well, proportionate bodies, as beauty, are in the eye of the beholder. Is
there such a thing as a universal conception of beauty?  Perhaps, what is
perceived to be proportionate by one would be seen as skinny by another.
Some like them big, some like them small, some like thin legs, others like
thick legs, and so forth and so on.  Would the employer potentially be
making a mistake by  choosing those that fit  his conception of beauty,
assuming it to be all peoples conceptions of beauty.

Reminds me of when I first met one of my friends sisters.  By Vietnamese men
perceptions, as I was explained, she was a vision of beauty.  As I learned
more, I realized her features did represent  beauty in Vietnamese culture.
But to me, although she was attractive, I didn't find her particularly
attractive.  In fact I found those, who were thought to be less attractive,
because of certain characteristics they held, to be far more attractive.
So, in fact, perhaps, proportions of attraction are relative to  those
choosing.  Now would the employer be able to choose a wide range of
attractive individuals to meet each individuals perceived model of
attraction, well then, we would have a wise employer in deed.  Me give me
someone with smarts, someone  who tries to make things better, someone with
foresight, someone with energy,  albeit less attractive and I guess I'd take
him/her to work with.  You can always make someone more attractive, you
can't always get the other traits. Send them to a gym and a beauty shop and
they will look better, try to get the other things and you'd probably be
waiting a longer time.

Craig

On 4/19/07, Tran Dinh Hoanh <tdhoanh at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> [ Vietnam Business Forum ]
>
>
> Dear Brother Thien & CACC,
>
> Thanks for the interesting point, brother Thien.  I have changed the
> subject title to Proportionate Body to focus on this phrase.
>
> I think brother Thien is playing Devil's Advocate, because you
> intentionally raised an argument usually raised by obnoxious employers.
> Sorry, in my line of thinking and attitude, Ngoai Hinh Can
> Doi  (Proportionate Body) is the phrase only fit for a slave master who is
> buying female slaves or a ma'  mi` looking for prostitutes.  I cannot see
> any justification for any employer to say that.  IN the US, if an employer
> says he want employees if Proportionate Body chances are he go bankrupt the
> next day, because no man or woman in their right mind would work for a
> person like that.
>
> Even if the employer is in the fashion business, he can say his employees
> have to be "presentable" (lich su).  That is enough to make his point and
> everyone would understand exactly what he wants.
>
> But we may talk in theory here.  The fact is the term NGoai Hinh Can doi
> and "Chan Dai" (long legs) is used as a fact in Vietnam for employers to
> focus on the body of the women they hire, including women for the job that
> need brain and not the body.  This shows how far behind the men of Vietnam
> is in their thinking and attitude.
>
> So brother Thien is right that there are job that need people who look
> presentable.  Actually any job require people who look presentable.  What is
> presentable varies with circumstances, and we all generally have an idea
> what they are.  But "Proportionate body"?  Common guys, that is simply so
> sexist and chauvinistic beyond my comprehension.
>
> Have a great day, brother Thien and all.
>
> Hoanh
>
>
> On 4/19/07, Tran Ba Thien <tranbathien at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > [ Vietnam Business Forum ]
> >
> >
> >
> >  Dear brother Hoanh,
> >
> > I totally agree your points of talent and business. but I want to focus
> > on your example of "ngoai hinh can doi" a little bit.
> >
> > generally, we need to define the concept of fair and concept of
> > equality. When I pay $50 for a shirt, I must receive it. Then you pay $100,
> > you must receive 2. It's fair. Then it's unfair if I ask shopkeeper to give
> > me 2 shirt. but the shopkeeper need to treat you and me with the same
> > service even you pay more than me. It's equal.
> >
> > In some particular business, for example in  a fashion shop, the boss of
> > the shop can employ shopkeeper with ngoai hinh can doi instead of not "can
> > doi". The boss might afraid that his customers wouldn't want to visit his
> > shop because his shopkeeper is not very beautiful. The boss cannot give his
> > business into the hand of someone that he cannot believe. the shop is his
> > property, his life and etc. We cannot say that his treatment for the case is
> > unequality.We need to interprete his excuse as difference in business.
> >
> > when he employ beautiful shopkeeper, he needs to pay more than not very
> > beautiful person. the decision of employment comes from his customers. they
> > love to see beautiful shopkeeper. When he meets their need, his business can
> > work well. Compare to the other business such as in making clothe factory.
> > customers of the factory don't need to see who makes their clotes. If the
> > director of the factory refuse someone by their appearance, it's unequal.
> > but the boss of the clothe showroom can refuse not very beautiful
> > shopkeepers. it's fair.
> >
> > When boss can prove that his business need beauty, he can select
> > beautiful workers. We should distinguish unequality in business with
> > difference in business.
> >
> > Best luck,
> > Tran Ba Thien
> > tranbathien at gmail.com
> >
> > --
> > Tran Dinh Hoanh, LLB, JD
> > Attorney of Law
> > Washington DC
> >
> >
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